Paris - Roubaix  2010
  • L_Space

    It’s not just for the pros. Here in the states we have a Masters woman, never been pro, never won an elite event, races about 3 times a year, only has won Master’s races, never gets invites to National events or clinics from the National federation, zero support from the National federation, yet she was put on the doping/whereabouts system and she must report her whereabouts for every hour of every day and hasn’t competed in any elite events in over a year during her short 6 year cycling history. The stress drives her crazy, but she knows that if she misses 3, her cycling career will be over (4 year suspension for a 48 year old). To me, this is just cruel, that anyone that wants to race a bike could be forced to have to go through this torture.

    • Alex

      After an alarming number of high positives (especially in relation to the number of tests being done) I find it hard to feel sorry for these masters racers. On group rides I go on I’ve heard masters racers talking about their doping. Everyone knew they were doping and USADA/USAC didn’t seem to care. Now that they are stepping up their game those masters racers have suddenly stopped racing and people who quit masters racing because they were tired of competing against roid’ed up guys that would verbally abuse them are now putting on their race wheels once again.

      • L_Space

        While there may be doping on all levels, from juniors, to pros, to masters, it seems more prudent to test the winners of the events rather than subject non-elite amateurs to a constant whereabouts nightmare. It’s not just a one hour window, they will test any time of the day, with 6 am being a favorite, no matter what you put in as your preferred hour. Anybody that races can be put on this list, for no apparent reason and no recourse to be removed, including retiring or not competing. You don’t have to be a pro or a top level elite. You get no special privileges for being on the list. You then have the joy of readjusting your whereabouts constantly, often several times a day, as plans change (traffic jams, long doctors appointment, staying out late for dinner, staying the night elsewhere at the last minute, a late business meeting, etc.). And those on the list already have a heads up that they may be (and will be) targeted and will likely stay clean, while the winners that are not on the list and don’t get tested and have doped, still get to steal the glory with no penalty. Seems more efficient to bring in testers to a race and batch test, rather than have them get up at 4 am and drive hours to individual’s homes.

        • jules

          in-competition testing only is a waste of time. it’s a green light to dope out-of-competition.

          it sounds like your female friend may been the subject of some ‘intelligence’ passed onto the anti-doping authorities. I doubt that they regularly pick some random amateur and decide “let’s go nuts testing her, just for fun!” although stranger things happen in life.

          • L_Space

            I’m pretty sure it was politically motivated. They don’t like Masters competitors making their young elite riders look bad, so I’m pretty sure they are hoping she trips up enough with testing that she’ll be suspended before she can beat them. The vitriol her other competitors and national coaches dish out to her seems to be proof of that.

            • jules

              by ‘they’ do you mean her competitors or the national federation? it’s easy for competitors to provide false information that may trigger a rival being subject to lots of testing.

              • L_Space

                If you can tell me how to find out what causes a person to get put on the list, I can answer that question. She has not been able to find out. And from what you’re saying, anybody who has an enemy is at risk of being falsely accused and put on the list without any verification by the federation.

                • jules

                  from what I understand, that’s true. it’s up to the anti-doping body to decide whether and how to act on information. they reserve the right to test any athlete – they don’t need to provide a justification.

            • campirecord

              Is this about doping, or your friend or politics. Out of competition check, whereabouts and bio passeport have done a ton of good work for cycling. If Peter Sagan can handle a whereabouts system, a local master elite can.

              • L_Space

                Peter Sagan does this for his job, has a manager that he pays to do the reporting for him, and only needs to specify ONE hour of each day. An amateur racer in the National Testing Pool (NTP) is working a job most likely not related to cycling, can not afford a manager to take on this burden, and must report their whereabouts for every 24 hours in the day, even as it changes throughout the day. Yes, it can and is done. Sagan doesn’t even have to think about it, but the NTP racer has to deal with this headache all day, every day.

                Doping is the basis for this system. My friend is stuck in this whereabouts nightmare. Most likely politics got her into it.
                Out of competition checks do not require the racer to be constantly vigilant with their whereabouts; just do the test and get on with life. Passport is only for the top level Pro racers or those that want to do an hour record attempt.

                • campirecord

                  I actually don’t care about the one friend, I would call that a technocratic casualty. I care about all the other dopers. Ask your friend to never eat spanish steak ? Ride a Fondo ?

            • donncha

              So you’ve a 48yr-old woman beating the elites? Doesn’t sound suspicious at all.

        • Alex

          I didn’t want to state the obvious bit that jules stated. And AFAIK if you don’t hold a USAC racing license they can’t test you. There is no legal requirement to submit to an anti-doping control from a sporting body.

    • campirecord

      I am sorry but I have never seen any amateur or master put on a wada whereabouts system. And I will also add like others, that USA masters are well known for going on these boutique rejuvenation clinics… The whereabouts program is very clear, every federation has a code for athletes that need to be on the program. I have never heard of any master, non olympic,non elite athlete be on it. Don’t confuse out of competition tests and whereabouts.

      • L_Space

        Not confused at all. When she wins at Masters Track Nats and Worlds, she gets tested. When she has to fill out her whereabouts for every hour of every day using the whereabouts system and gets knocks on the door (3 times this year), then that is whereabouts. She is a Master’s World Record holder, politically didn’t have a prayer to go to the events that would allow her to qualify for the Olympics, tried her hand at maybe a dozen Elite events at the track over the course of her career of 6 years (none in the last 12 months) and got some seconds and thirds in the 500 (does that make her an Elite athlete?). I guess the message is for Masters riders to stay away from any Elite events or you could suffer with the whereabouts program.

        • Neil_Robinson

          isn’t the whereabouts protocol to report one hour in the day, not every hour in the day?

          • L_Space

            No, that’s the misconception. International riders must be at an appointed place for one hour of a day. Domestic and amateur riders must report every hour and they can test at any hour of the 24 hours in a day and if you are not at where they expect you to be at that hour, you get a missed test. 3 misses in 12 months and you get a 4 year ban.

            • jules

              what?!

              • L_Space

                If you review the document http://www.usada.org/wp-content/uploads/athlete-handbook.pdf on page 25 you’ll see that athletes in the National Testing Pool (NTP) do not provide a 60 minute time slot. Then on page 28 it says they could receive a filing failure if “Their whereabouts information is inaccurate or incomplete to reasonably
                locate them for testing.”. So if you were going to be at a restaurant at 7pm and a crash on the freeway prevents you arriving until 9 and the testers showed up there at 7 and you failed to update you whereabouts, that’s one strike.

                • Paul Jakma

                  My reading is that NTP is supposed to be slightly more relaxed than ITP. The whereabouts filing is supposed to be for known *regular* activities during that day, where the athlete would normally be, and the NTP athlete does NOT have to nominate a specific slot. Further, if you look at the summary on page 25 you will notice an NTP athlete, unlike ITP, can _not_ fail for a “Missed Test” precisely because they do not nominate a specific time. They can only fail for not providing correct information.

                  Here’s from another document from Team USA:

                  “Whereabouts Filing

                  For each day during the following quarter, the name and address of each location where the Athlete will train,
                  work or conduct any other regular activity (e.g. school), as well as the usual time-frames for such regular
                  activities;

                  Missed Tests

                  Under the IST, an Athlete may only receive a Missed Test if he or she is unavailable for testing during his or her
                  designated 60-minute time slot. Therefore, pursuant to this Policy and consistent with the IST, only ITP Athletes
                  are subject to Missed Tests because NTP athletes are not required to provide a 60-minute time slot with their
                  Whereabouts Filings.”

                  Next, again unlike ITP, an NTP athlete will be _phoned_ at the start of the testing hour – which can only be during the known times the athlete gave.

                  So, I don’t think I trust your characterisation of the process at all, as the NTP protocol appears designed to be _less strict_ than ITP.

                  • L_Space

                    Too bad reality does not fit your characterization. She does not have regular hours (no school or place of employment, being self-employed and constantly on the phone wherever she is); she’ll have business meetings at all different times, goes to the gym when an opening arises, fits in her riding when other activities allow; every hour of every day of every week is different. All 24 hours of the day are considered “known times” and she is responsible to define her location for each of those hours. If the information changes during the day due to circumstances, then that information is no longer correct and subject to a fail. She HAS failed with a missed test due to not being at a location described during the 24 hours of her whereabouts. All of the 24 hours must be accounted for with correct information. That’s why the NTP athlete is given a phone call if they are not at the known location (unlike the ITP athlete), because it’s NOT just one 60 minute window, it’s any hour of the day. So she’s no longer allowed to turn off her phone when she sleeps, even though her clients may call while she’s sleeping. She would LOVE to have just one 60-minute window per day instead of every hour of the day.

        • campirecord

          Well that is different, if you have won national and expect to be at worlds, yes. It is the same in other countries. All 7 “elite” who decided to buy a “career” plane ticket for worlds…sorry, I’m out… It’s just not the kind of issue at play here in the developing pelotons in any UCI races. Look at all the dopers in amateur US races… its a running gag.

          • L_Space

            Don’t confuse MASTERS National and MASTERS Worlds with those of the Elite competitors. Much lower level. She’s never won Elite Nationals or had a chance to go to Elite Worlds.

            • campirecord

              I am not.

    • Paul Jakma

      “she must report her whereabouts for every hour of every day” – that’s just factually incorrect. It’s 1 hour – of her choice – every day.

  • jules

    the staunch defenders of the Essendon FC dopers need to read this. they are given ample opportunity to disclose supplements, injections, etc. Essendon claims it was all above board, but when asked by anti-doping authorities to disclose any substances – legal or otherwise – they stayed shtoom. amnesia, I’m sure. the lying liars!

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  • Ghisallo

    I am glad there was never a possibility of me being an elite athlete. I will warn my children against ever pursuing such a dehumanizing profession.

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