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May 30, 2017
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  • Velt

    You compared the shifting lever feel to super record, is it safe to say that your observations are the same for chorus as wells?

    Also: Doesn’t 11s 105 come in a silver finish?

    • Yep, Super Record and Chorus are equivalent in terms of the shifting mechanism in the levers.
      As for Shimano Silver 105 groupset, yes it exists but it’s not a “classic” silver finish.

      • Morten Reippuert Knudsen

        Im pretty sure that a Potenza groupset with Chours levers will be the choise of lots of home mechanics / custom builders.

        • Steven Limmer

          I can confirm that. Potenza made economical sense, but I was upgrading from Chorus 10spd, and couldn’t give up the downshift range. It looks amazing on the bike. I’m also using an Overdrive crankset, because the current Campy range doesn’t offer 165mm cranks

    • Morten Reippuert Knudsen

      Grey is not silver….

  • markpa

    As an Athena owner it’s useful to read “all but 11-32 are compatible with Campagnolo’s other 11-speed groupsets.” and that Chorus chain is still the go to.
    Is the rest of the gruppo compatible?
    “Potenza’s Ergopower levers resemble current Athena levers”, I need new levers and can’t see a reason why the levers wouldn’t be OK. But we all know what happens if we assume it will work.

    • Potenza uses the same Rev11 guts as the carbon groupsets. With a change in rear derailleur geometry provided by Rev11, I suspect Potenza levers won’t work precisely with Athena derailleurs, but I haven’t tested the combination.

    • Morten Reippuert Knudsen

      THey problery wont work very well. geometry and cable pull is fundamentlly different from rev 2015 and before. Funny enough, old 10 speed Chorus/Record levers works really well with the 2015 front deraillure i’d say better than my 2015 Chorus levers
      – 10 speed levers and pre 2015 11-speed front deraillure was an awfull mix.

  • velocite

    What is this distinction between a ‘racing’ groupset and one that isn’t?

    • In the past, Campagnolo has designated Super Record, Record and Chorus as racing groupsets. That distinction has disappeared from it current catalogue (but not my mind), which now distinguishes its groupsets as electronic, carbon or aluminium.

      • Steven Limmer

        What’s the difference – the downshift. Up to and including Potenza, you can only drop one sprocket using the thumb-shifter. Chorus and above, you can drop 3; perfect for racing when it gets fast

  • Larry @CycleItalia

    Thanks for the long-term review – we’re having a prototype rental bike put together with 11-32 in back and 34.50 up front. Meanwhile, the 2017 Campagnolo catalog I have shows Athena still alive and well, as long as you want 3 front chainrings. It’s a little vague on whether the polished alloy option is still available for Athena however. Disclaimer: Campagnolo is an official supplier to CycleItalia

    • Wilson

      ‘Prototype’ lol

      • Larry @CycleItalia

        What do you find amusing about this? The definition of prototype is “a first, typical or preliminary model of something, especially a machine, from which other forms are developed or copied.” which in our case is just that – if this one, built to our specifications turns out well and cost estimates are accurate we’ll order more examples to add to our rental fleet.

        • Wilson

          You’re just such a dork, it’s not like your going into space! ????

          • Larry @CycleItalia

            Thanks for your comments, Wilson. I’m truly sorry that my use of the word ‘prototype’ has bothered you so much . Perhaps in the future you can contribute to CYCLINGTIPS something more than your high-school level snark?

  • slowK

    This may be a silly question, but can someone explain the advantage of having two separate rear derailleurs? A medium cage will handle up to a 32, a short cage less. Wouldn’t it just be easier to have just one derailleur that can handle wider range cassettes? Is there some other advantage to short cage derailleurs I’m not seeing?

    • Hexsense

      normally short cage weight less and hold chain tighter so lower chance to drop the chain.

      And most importantly, it looks better IMO.

    • It’s a valid point and one that may be gaining traction. The new Dura-Ace 9100 rear derailleur has a longer cage to allow a 30T cog; it’s not as long as a mid-cage, but it isn’t a short cage either. It’s a clear acknowledgement that while the pros can push tight cassettes, everybody else would rather the extra range of a widely-spaced cassette.

      At this stage, Campagnolo doesn’t offer a mid-cage derailleur for its racing/carbon groupsets, but I know of one mechanic that has fitted a Potenza mid-cage to a Super Record body to allow the owner to use a 32T cog.

      • slowK

        Thanks Hexsense and Matt.

      • Maximus

        If you set up carefully you can easily get a short cage mech to work well with 32T. Bear in mind the manufacturer puts in a margin for user error when stating limits. Proceed carefully and you’ll be fine.

        • Larry @CycleItalia

          We’ve had reports from clients that an 11-32 cogset works even with EPS, though it depends on the chainstay length, chain length, etc. As to the question of “the silly thumb shifter” – IMHO it’s the best part of Ergopower, never any confusion about upshifting or downshifting compared to their competitors.

    • Luke Bartlett

      it’s all about how much chain you must ‘store’ while on the smallest combination of teeth in order to have ‘zero’ storage while on the largest combination of teeth. to short cage is lighter and ‘neater, but can obviously store less chain. longer cage derailleurs are required when the storage is too high for a shorter cage. So both the chainring differential and the cassette differential is important.

      • This is a great way to explain the concept, Luke. Please excuse me if I borrow it sometime in the future.

      • slowK

        Thanks – that’s clear. The marginal advantages of the shorter cage just don’t seem that strong to me. If I’m in the small chainring, I’m usually in the lower/bigger cogs on the rear cassette, so the chain tension shouldn’t be too loose if I was cross-chaining small/small.

        • Luke Bartlett

          Yeh, well really if you don’t cross chain you should be able to get away with a shorter cage derailleur than you would need otherwise, because you’re ‘locking out’ extreme chain lengths (small small/big big) and therefore need to take up less slack. So that is why you can get away with short cage with a big range IF you use gears ‘properly’. Really as with everything it comes down to your use. If you are racing you want to have the lightest components- thats why short cage exists (plus maybe some aesthetics) – whereas if you want a wide range, the longer cages are for you.

          • winkybiker

            If you’re going to run a cage too short for your range of gears (which is fine), it’s probably better to have your chain too long for small-small combos, than to have it too short for big-big combos. The latter will break your derailleur if you inadvertently shift to big-big. So size it just long enough for the worst big-big cross chain. It will sag on small-small but you shouldn’t be running that combo anyway. (In her autobiography, Nicole Cook talks about “short chain” setups in MTB to reduce the chance of chain drop. But she’s Nicole Cook.)

  • Luke Bartlett

    nice review, it was useful for you to show that it is in fact similar to ultegra, as i would have assumed it was like a 105 level or lower given its ‘ranking’. i might have to try it out on my next bike. looks good on the concorde!

    • DaveRides

      I’d happily drive the fourth-best Ferrari available if someone told me I had to.

      • Luke Bartlett

        Well, i spose no one told me i had to, plus shimano parts are so much cheaper on replacement:)

        I HATE getting my Ferrari serviced…

  • Holby City

    Will they ever get rid of the silly thumb shifter?

    • Hopefully not!!! :-)

    • Morten Reippuert Knudsen

      its not called silly, its called the only decent ergonomics way of downsifting..

  • Roel

    How did you fit the modern 130mm rear hub into the old 126mm Concorde frame?

    • 2wheelsandme

      Steel baby! It can be easily tweaked.

      • Morten Reippuert Knudsen

        Unless Heat Treated or air hardendt: yes – aka not recomended on Super Vitus, Tange Prestige or Reynolds 753.

    • Not all classic Concorde frames have 126mm rear spacing. This Squadra from the very ealy ’90s had 130mm spacing.

    • Paolo

      all end-of-80s frames and later have 130mm spacing.

  • Pannonian Fit

    damn now we need sora r3000 in-depth review, I’ve been waiting for almost a year now

  • bikeclips

    Great review. Any idea whether/how much the choice of cables here contributes to the ‘sponginess’ of the shifts at the lever Matt? Tested SR with the same cables before?

    • That sponginess was a product of the mechanism in the shifter, a little bit of travel that could be felt before it started pulling on the cable. It’s a small thing that makes the racing levers (Chorus, Record, Super Record) feel more positive.

  • Wil

    I’m indifferent about the groupset as I’m not a Campag fan, but that Concorde is flippin lovely. I’ve been on ebay all afternoon trying to find one in half decent condition in a 56….

  • Allez Rouleur

    I’ve made sorta half-hearted efforts at getting the pads out of my Chorus holders more than once. They’re not budging. I’ve searched for recommendations and not found any good ones. I’d be thrilled to see Campagnolo completely switch over the the Shimano/Sram holder design!

    • Biker Mark

      Slide the pads in with some spit; pry them out with a thin flat blade screwdriver. Removal doesn’t damage the pad as long as you work slowly starting at the open end and working your way towards the front. (Remove the wheel before doing this.)

      • Allez Rouleur

        Thank you for the reply. Okay, I’ll try your method one night this week. Thanks!

    • JustinNL

      If you have a table/counter top in your work space you can easily push the pads out using that, but that does require removing the entire brake from the bike…

      Another option is to use a open ended wrench, somewhere around 8-10mm I believe, that gives you more surface area to push the pad out with. It’s a little harder with the rear wheel though. Removing the wheels will of course help.

      • Allez Rouleur

        Thank you for the reply. What part of the wrench should I be pushing with?

        • JustinNL

          You would use the end that looks like a horseshoe. I think the english call it a “spanner” and in American english call it’s a “open-ended wrench”, just to be sure we’re talking about the same wrench. The opposite end (which is usually a closed 6/8 point) fits nicely in the hand to push against.

          I personally prefer to just remove the brake and use a countertop or table. It’s the safest, for you and your bike.

  • Pedro Rocha

    Hi!
    Great review, complete and very understandable!

    But i have a question, you are really sure that power torque dosent work in trek bb90?? Because the ultra torque fits, ando the sistems are very similar.

    Thanks

    • The bearing sizes are the same, so it looks like a Power Torque crank should fit, but I’ve yet to find confirmation that it will. Anybody riding a Trek with Power Torque cranks out there?

  • Avuncular

    Good to see them design a simply installed and removable chainset, although most will need to buy a 14mm allen key. I think a 12-32 cassette would be nice too as it would tighten up the gear range a little. If you need a 32 you probably don’t need the 11.

    • Morten Reippuert Knudsen

      14-36 would suit me just fine today – was really fond of my 10-speed 13/29t 10 years ago – Campys 10-speed 12/30t one off was a little too wide to be perfect when i replaced the 13/29t.

      • Avuncular

        Yes I agree lower gears are my wish these days too. I’m also looking at a sub compact now as I rarely even get into the 50.

      • István Fedor

        13/29 is the best all rounder, and 13/26 is my choice for flat terrain. I ride solo, thus it is all i need with 50t chainring

    • István Fedor

      Pt plus uses 10 mm allen screw, not 14 as its predecessor

  • AlaskaFreddy

    Matt,

    Great article. At your level of review, however, for this reader you haven’t sufficiently touched what it means to set up and run a factory in Kunshun, China or over in Malaysia. People who buy this stuff are not just buying parts, they are also buying into the “system” that produced them. Yes, you touched on the Romanian factory, but you completely steered away from talking about what it is like to work in these factories in China. I respect your review, but as the network that bicycle components manufacturers use to produce, market and deliver a product becomes ever more diverse and sophisticated, so too does the need of the modern cycling reviewer to be ever more sophisticated in his or her ability to peer through the smoke. In other words, you left out the part about Shimano dumping its components on the international market to drive SRAM and Campagnolo out of business. Because of this, yes, it is a great review, but at the core of it I don’t trust one, single word of it. You give me 10 engineers to your one because I don’t have to pay them as much and I will come up with a better shifter than you too. Then there is the factory.

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